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  • Fake 1892 ZAR "SS" Crown

    Hi all

    Please be careful of following listing:
    Silver Coins - yes yes yes 1892 single shaft 5 shilling,,,,not offen seen ,,, read more for sale in Hartbeespoort (ID:25597623)

    Please see more about fakes:


    http://images.bidorbuy.co.za/user_im...6_page0001.jpg

    http://images.bidorbuy.co.za/user_im...3_page0002.jpg

    Notes:

    1.Overall wear pattern is not consistent with fields.
    2.Milling on coin does not correspond to any other zar coins.
    3.Serrations flattened and irregular.
    4.Inspection with a 10X glass shows clear porosity in the surface of the coin,
    also visible between the milled section on the rim.
    5.The colour of the coin is not consistent with the age or wear of the coin
    6.The weight of the coin is incorrect. It weighs 21g – 27g well below the 28.287g that it should weigh. Taking a test batch of 7 VF+ coins they all weigh in 28.14 plus and remain in designated weight range. I have see fakes that weights correct, but then all diameters is out.
    7.The lettering on the reverse the L and E will show an overlay consistent
    with a casting.
    8.The shoulder appears weak with no definition


    Regards


    Thomas van der Spuy
    ZARBOY
    Last edited by ZARBOY; 02-09-10, 20:44.
    "Look in the past for all that is good and beautiful, take that for your ideal and build on it your future".
    Items I am selling.

  • #2
    Thanks for the warning, Thomas. I feel sorry for the bidders.
    Yesterday I was clever and wanted to change the world.
    Today I am wise and am changing myself.

    Comment


    • #3
      Not that anything you said in your post makes sense to me, but as a Bobber that loves looking at coins, Thanks for the thumbs up. I learn something new every day.

      Regards
      We do IT!
      See all our listings here...

      Comment


      • #4
        Thomas, how do you know this? Have you seen this coin personally?
        Visit my hive!

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by BumbleBee View Post
          Thomas, how do you know this? Have you seen this coin personally?
          Hi Stephen

          I HAVE NOT seen this coin personally. I have seen to many fakes in my 12 years of collecting coins, mainly ZAR Coins. You get to a point where one can almost spot the problems by just seeing the overall appearance of the coins.

          I gave Allyn Jacobs a fake/replica to be used in Brian Hern's " Hern's Handbook on South African Tokens " I made my personal full study on the coin - not to be caught!!!
          This kind of replica/fake is luckily enough easy to spot.

          Would love to know what the exact weight of the coin on auction is.

          See a perfect example with nice pictures of a genuine crown:
          Silver Coins - 1892 5 shilling ss EF for sale in Pretoria / Tshwane (ID:24965176)

          Regards

          Thomas van der Spuy
          ZARBOY
          Last edited by ZARBOY; 01-09-10, 15:57. Reason: error
          "Look in the past for all that is good and beautiful, take that for your ideal and build on it your future".
          Items I am selling.

          Comment


          • #6
            Bugger, ok that is a good looking coin. I see what you mean now, the difference is quite obvious.

            Now, let me go ask the seller if I can swap a kidney for it.
            Visit my hive!

            Comment


            • #7
              Hi

              I'm sure the seller does not even know himself that the coin is a fake. What I can't understand is that buyers knowing about all the chinese fakes just place bids on these coins without determining the coins authenticity? This is one of the easiest fakes to see.

              Anybody can PM me with their email address and I will gladly email them the word document I have on the fake crowns. This will help buyers in determining the coins authenticity.

              Hope you are not the leading bidder Stephen.?.?.?.???

              Regards

              Thomas van der Spuy
              ZARBOY
              "Look in the past for all that is good and beautiful, take that for your ideal and build on it your future".
              Items I am selling.

              Comment


              • #8
                Thomas, I don't actively bid on ZAR coins. Don't know enough about them to start collecting. I have a few "hand-me-downs" which I decided to put on auction today, thats all the ZAR I have.

                Looking at the pics of the fake next to the original it almost looks like the fake is smiling just a little, as if it knows it's going to catch you. On the genuine crown Oom Paul looks quite serious, almost tired even.
                Visit my hive!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Thomas

                  You are considered a specialist in these coins and I think BOB should heed your warning and notify the sellers and buyers until authenticity can be proven,

                  Just my thoughts
                  STEVE
                  “Numismatists are the guardians of history for future generations”

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Hi Steve

                    Authenticity does NOT need to be proven. One can clearly see from the picture the coin is a fake. Most collectors that has seen these chinese fakes will agree that it is very easy to spot them in the ZAR SS Crowns.

                    To make matters even worse, the seller answers a question where he/she confirms that the coin weight is 30gr ( confirming that the coin is a fake). A true ZAR crown cannot weight 30grams. If this was a true ZAR crown the weight for this wear would have been around 28.05gr - 28.2gr. A kitchen scale will register the coin at a perfect 28gr if it does not weight .1 of a gram.

                    I did make use of the community watch function and received an email that it is being investigated. I also warned the seller, through Q&A, that the coin is a fake. Nothing came from both.....SAD:(

                    Regards,

                    Thomas van der Spuy
                    ZARBOY
                    "Look in the past for all that is good and beautiful, take that for your ideal and build on it your future".
                    Items I am selling.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by ZARBOY View Post
                      Hi all

                      Please be careful of following listing:
                      Silver Coins - yes yes yes 1892 single shaft 5 shilling,,,,not offen seen ,,, read more for sale in Hartbeespoort (ID:25597623)

                      Please see more about fakes:


                      http://images.bidorbuy.co.za/user_im...6_page0001.jpg

                      http://images.bidorbuy.co.za/user_im...3_page0002.jpg

                      Notes:

                      1.Overall wear pattern is not consistent with fields.
                      2.Milling on coin does not correspond to any other zar coins.
                      3.Serrations flattened and irregular.
                      4.Inspection with a 10X glass shows clear porosity in the surface of the coin,
                      also visible between the milled section on the rim.
                      5.The colour of the coin is not consistent with the age or wear of the coin
                      6.The weight of the coin is incorrect. It weighs 21g – 27g well below the 28.287g that it should weigh. Taking a test batch of 7 VF+ coins they all weigh in 28.14 plus and remain in designated weight range. I have see fakes that weights correct, but then all diameters is out.
                      7.The lettering on the reverse the L and E will show an overlay consistent
                      with a casting.
                      8.The shoulder appears weak with no definition


                      Regards


                      Thomas van der Spuy
                      ZARBOY
                      Hi Thomas
                      Many thanks, something learned, atleast E and L.
                      wish to see more.

                      regards
                      Dulal

                      Comment

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