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  • Block buyers...

    (If this has been discussed already, my apologies - a search did not return any results.)

    Now that we have the facility to block buyers, will the BoB system use that info to, for example, auto-globally-block/blacklist buyers who are blocked by a certain number of sellers?

    Or perhaps also state the number of blocks on the rating page of the buyer?
    Obligatory link to my listings.

  • #2
    Originally posted by RISadler View Post
    (If this has been discussed already, my apologies - a search did not return any results.)

    Now that we have the facility to block buyers, will the BoB system use that info to, for example, auto-globally-block/blacklist buyers who are blocked by a certain number of sellers?

    Or perhaps also state the number of blocks on the rating page of the buyer?
    I don't think this will add much value and is a good source to determine bad buyer behaviour. Looking at the current data, between March and July 6583 user-blocks occurred:
    • 5447 unique users have been blocked
    • No single user has been blocked more than 12 times (
    • 4 users are blocked by 12 sellers
    • 3 users are blocked by 10 sellers
    • 6 users are blocked by 8 sellers
    • 5 users are blocked by 7 sellers
    • 10 users are blocked by 5 sellers
    • 4725 users are blocked by individual sellers
    • Only 10% of users blocked are actually black-listed
    • Over 80% of the blocked users are verified and/or having good ratings (above 90%)

    Without going into too much detail (and this is my observation) - buyers have been blocked:
    • By sellers as they offer competing/similar products
    • By sellers as they had some conflict (more emotional) with buyers
    • By sellers as the buyer did not conclude the purchase

    Looking at those stats and looking at some sellers and their individual blocked user listed I think most of the blocks are on a emotional level - there are quite a few sellers who will go and block a buyer if they don't receive a good rating (although a seller is at fault for delayed shipping, poor communication etc).

    We originally thought that the blocked-buyer list could be a useful metric to determine bad buyers, but honestly some of those buyers are highly rated, purchase lots of items on a daily basis and land up in a blocked list.

    As an example: One buyer with 224 positive ratings (98%) was blocked by 12 sellers (14 purchases in total with only 4 positive, 0 neutral and 1 negative rating received). Incidentally, that buyer complained to the seller, as the seller started deleting bids as the sale did not turn out the way he wanted - and this is pretty much a trend I see in the blocking behavior.
    Review www.bidorbuy.co.za on alexa.com
    Motivation is what gets you started. Habit is what keeps you going.

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    • #3
      Thanks, Mac.

      But I must differ from some of your interpretations... there's a lot of "rating blackmail" going on and one of the ways to prevent this is to block those types of buyers. Yes, it is "emotional", but it is also a form of protection.

      It is also a good system to get "only-pay-after-SNC-filed" buyers out of our hair.

      Obviously the BoB system has the "blacklist" system to deal with scammers, shills and others. Can this "blocked buyer" system then not be the equivalent for sellers to protect ourselves against bad/rude buyers?
      Obligatory link to my listings.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by RISadler View Post
        Can this "blocked buyer" system then not be the equivalent for sellers to protect ourselves against bad/rude buyers?
        I don't think that providing a top-XX list of blocked buyers to sellers is the right way to go. I was quite surprised to see that in the top-20 blocked buyer list a large number of buyers did in my opinion nothing wrong (i.e. no SNCs filed, no rating issues, no strange Q&A's) - so not quite conclusive why they landed up in the first place.

        BTW: There are 5 sellers contributing to 2500 blocked buyers (of which the majority of buyers have good ratings) - should make one think and if those sellers would do the same thing if they had to face people face-to-face instead of clicking a button - or?
        Review www.bidorbuy.co.za on alexa.com
        Motivation is what gets you started. Habit is what keeps you going.

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        • #5
          Emotion does play a huge factor in blocking people. I blocked a buyer (relatively new) who only had glowing ratings and looked wonderful on paper.

          He bought something from me and I never heard a word from him. When filing the SNC I noticed that he had bought exactly the same item from another seller. Mine was from 1969 the one he bought (for the same price) was from 1965.

          IF he had taken the trouble to respond to my e-mails and explained why he preferred the other item I would have happily filed the SNC as "buyer and seller agree to cancel".

          The fact that he totally ignored me annoyed me - I rated negative and blocked him.

          Emotional - yes. Justified in my eyes - yes. Do I wish to deal with him again - No.

          He may turn out to be one of the buyers with 1,000s of positive ratings, but in my book he is rude and I'd rather not deal with him.

          The fact that 5 sellers are blocking 2,500 buyers is scary. They must be huge sellers. I'd love to know who they are and take a look at their ratings ;).
          Items I have for sale.

          Why do today what you can put off till next year?

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          • #6
            I think the biggest problem on Bob is ratings.
            It is a necessary evil but is used indiscrimnately.(SPELLING?)
            1) Buyer is angry because he thinks he has been mislead so the reaction is click negative button.Emotional yes!
            2) Seller reacts revenge rates. Emotional yes!

            Are we kids!!Apparently--I am one of the culprits but I go cold when I get a negative rating.I don't like to think that I have done something wrong or should I say let a buyer down.

            I have learned not to revenge rate because it becomes a vicious circle and the chances of it being resolved are reduced.

            It is all about communication. The buyer should email or phone the seller and try and resolve the issue first.
            Growl at him/her and he will growl back. We are all human we make mistakes.

            I think Bob should draft an email to all buyers and sellers to educate them on the rating system or allow some kind of note to come up when that negative button is pressed to instruct the user giving the rating to think about his response.
            I am sure there are a large number of negative ratings that are unnecessary. A great majority of the time a neutral rating would be more appropriate.

            It is all about communication,communcation,communication.As Mellowred has said. Buyers and sellers who simply ignore communication are a real frustration.I always make a few attempts to contact a buyer if he has not paid before filing an SNC.

            My 2cents worth. (I dont want a negative rating.I am paranoid about it)
            Last edited by geewhizz; 08-07-10, 20:39.
            VIEW MY ITEMS!

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            • #7
              Originally posted by geewhizz View Post

              My 2cents worth. (I dont want a negative rating.I am paranoid about it)
              Not a good idea to advertise it, some people will take advantage if they know this.....;)
              bidorbuy Forum Administrator



              bidorbuy.co.za - Africa's largest market place.
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              < TAKE THE TIME TO GIVE US A GOOD RATING

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              • #8
                Originally posted by admin View Post
                Not a good idea to advertise it, some people will take advantage if they know this.....;)
                Buyers cant take advantage of me I take advantage of myself where buyers are concerned but I am not perfect.
                Only you have the privelege of removing my comment.

                Bob is a community of users--One does not always have to go a long way to find the good spirited folk but some users ????
                VIEW MY ITEMS!

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                • #9
                  Hello all

                  I could have said: play the rating game the same way that the Germans played in the world cup. But now I would love to add, play it the way the Spaniards do – stay cool – stay in control.

                  Regards

                  Jacques
                  Philately starts where the catalogue stops.
                  Items I have for sale.

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                  • #10
                    What? Happy go lucky..
                    Attached Files
                    VIEW MY ITEMS!

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by MacMuffin View Post
                      BTW: There are 5 sellers contributing to 2500 blocked buyers
                      Isn't this a bit abusive of the blocking system? That's a lot of buyers to such a few sellers!!
                      I know not what World War 3 will be fought with, but World War 4 will be fought with sticks & stones - Albert Einstein.

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                      • #12
                        The way I see it, is that the rating system is the big reputation maker and breaker. Unfortunately there are other factors involved when selling on the Internet and using a third-party for delivery.

                        For example, buyer is satisfied with the item, but due to a postal strike delivery took two weeks = buyer gives seller a negative. Why? Because the overall deal did not go smoothly and buyer, for some weird reason, feels the postal strike was orchestrated by the seller/her fault/whatever.

                        Do I want to risk my 100% reputation selling to such buyers? No. If other sellers of note are blocking a specific buyer because he/she is rude, resorts to "ratings" blackmail, only pays after SNC is filed, etc. then I want to know this and want nothing to do with the buyer.

                        I have on another thread suggested expanding the ratings buyers can give to sellers, but sellers also need the same expansion and blocking a buyer seems like a definite solution.
                        Obligatory link to my listings.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by kebs View Post
                          Isn't this a bit abusive of the blocking system? That's a lot of buyers to such a few sellers!!
                          That's exactly our point and we will revisit this. In my opinion sellers unfairly block buyers and the traditional rating-, SNC- and blacklisting process should take care of this. From history, sellers asked for this feature as disgruntled buyers (or even competitive sellers) used to bump up sellers sales and then SNC out of it.

                          The rating from a buyer/seller perspective will be reworked over the next few months and will show more granular rating (in communication, fulfillment/shipping, payment, reliability etc).

                          I see it simply in this way - compare the buyer/seller experience to the real world:
                          - I purchased from a book-shop at a mall before. The next time I pick up a book, get to the till and want to purchase, the shop-owner tells me that I am not welcome. I have the money, but the shop-owner did not like the way I communicated before or the type of questions I asked or because I did not particularly like the quality of the item I bought.
                          - So now I had a bad buying-experience and based on that I will certainly avoid that shop (if not all the shops in that mall).
                          - Yes, it is everyone's right to refuse a sale and on BoB we have those mechanisms - via deleting bids, relisting, SNC- or blacklisting processes.

                          I just don't believe it is justified for sellers to block buyers with 100% positive ratings and as such we will introduce measures to rectify it, because those very same sellers spoil the opportunities for every other seller on BoB. Trends do show, that 1st-time-buyers (who are not familiar with BoB and the workings of it and get presented with arrogance/rudeness/impatience by sellers) do not return to BoB and other sellers miss out.

                          We will release communication regarding this formally during the course of next week and what actions will be taken.

                          In closing - yes, the cyberworld allows people to behave differently in real life, but looking at some of the conduct here, I doubt that one would treat people in this way face to face.
                          Review www.bidorbuy.co.za on alexa.com
                          Motivation is what gets you started. Habit is what keeps you going.

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                          • #14
                            I just don't believe it is justified for sellers to block buyers with 100% positive ratings and as such we will introduce measures to rectify it, because those very same sellers spoil the opportunities for every other seller on BoB. Trends do show, that 1st-time-buyers (who are not familiar with BoB and the workings of it and get presented with arrogance/rudeness/impatience by sellers) do not return to BoB and other sellers miss out.

                            Sorry but I disagree with this. A quick look through the buyers I am blocking shows that most are either blacklisted or nearly there, however there are about 5 or so I am blocking who have good ratings...reasons why:
                            Buying quite a few items and then when payment due no longer wanting these items
                            Buying items and having to file snc's for payment
                            Buying an item last year and then deciding not even a few weeks ago that they would like to return the item (& because I sit with the threat of a positive rating changing to a negative rating I have no choice but to refund said buyer)

                            Would you go into any shop, ask them to keep items for you for two weeks & once the cashier has rung up the items say "oh I don't think I'll bother taking them, I saw them cheaper next door" or would you hum & haw regards payment & eventually only pay once the manager has stipulated that you must or would you buy an item today from any shop worldwide & imagine you have the right to return it next year?

                            Because most sellers realise that if they give a negative rating to a buyer it will be reciprocated perhaps instead of giving negative or any ratings they are simply blocking problem buyers?
                            VIEW MY ITEMS!



                            “You have enemies? Good. That means you’ve stood up for something, sometime in your life.” - Winston Churchill

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by MacMuffin View Post
                              I just don't believe it is justified for sellers to block buyers with 100% positive ratings ...
                              Why not?

                              I had an "experience" with a buyer with 100% rating... he bought an item, but did not want to pay for insurance. SpeedServices lost the parcel and this buyer insisted that I refund him the full purchase price plus postage. He even reported me to hello@bidorbuy.co.za when I refused. (And, boy, was "hello" rude/derogatory towards me!)

                              Due to "ratings" blackmail, there are a lot of rude/bad buyers out there with 100% ratings. Using that as a benchmark is not very accurate or wise.
                              Obligatory link to my listings.

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