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  • How should the improved rating work?

    I am opening this thread to get feedback to assist us in improving on the current rating mechanism. I anticipate some good (and emotional/heated feedback) as it is probably one of the most discussed/complained/argued topic in all our lives here at BoB.

    We have not decided on the specifics and we obviously value your input in what is a better way to provide ratings. I think the ratings at the moment are very subjective: "if you rate me bad, I will rate you bad". Rating abuse and revenge-rating is far too common.

    Just looking through the forums, the help desk calls and emails we get there are so many cases where ratings are not fair. We want to try and make the rating more objective (a challenge in itself, as it is almost impossible to remove emotions from a business transaction you have just conducted).

    I sketch the revised rating as follows (this is a draft and not cast in stone):
    • The positive, neutral, negative rating stays as it currently is.

    • We will associate an optional "category" to the comments which will allow us display graphically - something like this:
      (don't comment on how the above looks like, think about the concept illustrated)

    • As an optional feature buyers and sellers can rate each other on a number of attributes. This is optional and should not result in geewhizz being "Ticked off", but will help the community as a whole to rate their experience with buyers and sellers on bidorbuy.

    • A buyer would rate a seller anonymously on attributes such as Accuracy of item description, Communication, Shipping Time, Shipping Costs, Quality of item (Your recommendations are needed here)

    • A seller would rate a buyer anonymously on attributes such as Communication, Payment Time (Your recommendations are needed here)

    • The anonymous rating of the buyer/seller attributes carries more weight/influence from users with higher credibility. i.e. a buyer who has a few hundred positive ratings will carry more weight on the seller's attributes than a first-time buyer.

    While the stars will still remain, you as a seller will be able to see from a buyers ratings if the buyer is a reliable payer or not. A buyer will be able to see if a seller has high shipping costs or does not deliver on time.

    While those attributes are optional to rate, it is in the buyers and sellers interest to rate on those to properly present the behaviour of a user.

    As said, we have not formally started with this initiative and are still "think-tanking" on the most appropriate way of doing this. We do strongly believe that a more fine-grained rating mechanism will improve the overall user-experience and will especially assist first time buyers.

    If for example a seller gets good/neutral ratings but is rated poorly on Shipping Costs or Shipping Time, this should really come as a wake-up call to improve or at least try to understand why this is so. The same applies to the buyers if they for example are rated for poor payments.

    The above will also allow BoB's customer care team to pull reports on buyer/seller behaviour where certain ratings are not at acceptable levels and then assist users to improve by offering seminars or advice. We also hope that this will allow us to "trend" a user and automatically identify if a user goes "bad" - at the moment we have no automatic way of doing this and heavily rely on the community.

    After all, even current ratings are based on the experience and interaction between buyer and seller and there are ways to turn those negatives and neutrals into positives.

    Let us know what you think about and give us constructive feedback here...
    Attached Files
    Last edited by MacMuffin; 16-07-10, 10:04.
    Review on
    Motivation is what gets you started. Habit is what keeps you going.

  • #2
    Hello Mac

    Thanks for the hard work.

    The “shipping time” bothers me though (look at my ratings and you will see that I am fairly fast). But, sometimes a buyer might pay after only eight days or more, with payment say reflecting on a Saturday morning. They will then want to know why the item was not shipped the day after they have paid (could have been on the Thursday afternoon. So the system is still be open to abuse.

    Thanks again and regards

    Philately starts where the catalogue stops.
    Items I have for sale.


    • #3
      This will not change my gripe that buyers who do not rate a seller leave the transaction"In the air" and the seller is left wondering if the item has arrived.

      Personally I think this will open the system to more abuse because if a seller rates a buyer low on the time it took the buyer to pay the buyer may just do likewise to the time it took the seller to send the item.
      Revenge rating is too common and as I say "4 or 5 ticks " is worse they 1--seriously
      Last edited by geewhizz; 15-07-10, 21:54.


      • #4
        Originally posted by dstorm View Post
        The “shipping time” bothers me though (look at my ratings and you will see that I am fairly fast). But, sometimes a buyer might pay after only eight days or more, with payment say reflecting on a Saturday morning. They will then want to know why the item was not shipped the day after they have paid (could have been on the Thursday afternoon. So the system is still be open to abuse.
        I forgot to mention one more important aspect and have updated the original post - The detailed rating is anonymous (BoB will know who provided what ratings). If a user wants to contest detailed ratings, BoB will review the ratings and delete unfair ratings.
        Review on
        Motivation is what gets you started. Habit is what keeps you going.


        • #5
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          • #6

            Very nice thoughts, however dont you think as long as the Positive, neutral and negative ratings stay, rating abuse and emotions are here to stay too?

            A very crazy idea:

            What about working the ratings on a scale, rather than the well defined "Positive" or "Negative". You can rate on sliding scale, Red to blue, or 1 to 10. Blue is a extremely good overall experience, red is a extremely bad overall experience. If you are rated from 0 - 4 (red), it will minus a rating (as per the current system). If you are rated 6 -10 (blue), it will add a rating. 5 will not add or minus a rating. (Equivalent to a neutral)

            The problem with the current system, is that a negative rating is believed to be the devil. It is dreaded, and hated - it will always be unfair (according to who gets it). When a seller gets a negative, it feels like his life has just ended. He will rate the buyer back negative.

            A sliding scale will take the emotion (at least most of it), out of that dreaded negative. Instead of getting that definite "Positive", or "Negative", you get rated on a scale. This idea, along with the optional "category" rating you have explained above, and the comment space, I think it may work nicely?

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            • #7
              I'm concerned that so many buyers that currently don't rate, will still not rate as they will see this as more "work".
              We might also end up with even fewer buyers rating as a result of this extra "work"

              Would the current criteria that are used to remove unfair ratings still apply?
              An example would be: If a buyer doesn't read the listing properly - which is very common - and then gives a bad rating as a result - would this be removed?
              Would only the comment be removed or the actual score or whatever it is as well? Removing the comment only would be unfair if as in this example, the buyer did not read the listing properly. I've seen problems (discussed on the forum) with crazy auctions where the buyer doesn't read the shipping and then expects not to pay shipping at all. Such a buyer would give a poor shipping score despite the fact that they did not read the listing properly. If only the comment was removed and not the score as well, this would give a poor impression of the seller, even though the seller was not at fault.

              Regarding the anonymous part, would this apply to the rating only and would the buyer / seller still see who gave them the rating and the rest of BoB not see who gave it?
              If it is totally anonymous, BoB might end up with even more queries as buyers and sellers won't be able to identify which buyer / seller gave them the bad rating.

              Anonymity might also lead to more abuse as buyers/sellers as they will feel they can do whatever they want as other Bobbers won't know who they are. This includes deliberately trying to sabotage another's ratings for fun which I have had personal experience with. A buyer told me that sellers rely on ratings much more than buyers do, so he would do whatever he liked as it didn't matter to him. He has a point as many buyers do not develop a relationship with BoB as sellers do. The sellers depend on their ratings and buyers are more casual about it. If they get blacklisted, they either choose not to visit BoB anymore or re-register with other details and start again. There is already a serious problem with this happening. The famous "Smiths" of the USA come to mind. They keep re-registering no matter how many times they are blacklisted.
              Last edited by Vinyl Lady Decals; 15-07-10, 23:21.
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              • #8
                Honestly I think the anonymous bit is not that good, I sometimes look to see who has rated if i see trusted names then I know it id safe.. I reckon it will lead to rating abuse of the troll kind
                Art, Stunning Ceramics, Jewellery Visit my Bob Shoppe, Antiques, Books, Music, Hand Basins and More


                • #9
                  I agree 100% with Tananka. All this new rating system will do is put more power in the hands of abusers. Revenge ratings do hurt a seller more but this system might actually be worse. And let's face it, sellers don't have the time to constantly be disputing ratings. Further, if the ratings are anonymous, then that desn't exactly work for all sellers either.
                  If a seller sells one item, gets a positive rating on the item and negatives on all else persay, how anonymous is that?

                  Would also like to know what criterion would apply. If a seller displays everythng with his isting inc. shipping costs and the buyer accepts the conditions by bidding/buying, then surely they can't complain on things like shipping costs afterward?

                  Buyers aren't required to include things like bank accounts or id no.'s when registering as this process would discourage rather than encourage them to continue.This is BOB lookng first at their interests and wanting to expand. Nothing wrong with that. But this is the main reason for revenge ratings, buyers re-registering all the time etc. Not the rating system. If buyers were forced to look after their names as sellers are obliged to do ethically and on the site, surely that would be the better answer in the long term.

                  Oh, another little thing. Why do threads from BOB always start " How should this work, or how should that work?" Why not ever, "What do you guys who use bOB everyday think about this or that?"- Just a thought
                  Last edited by brands online; 15-07-10, 23:23.
                  "Where Delivery Meets Expectation"


                  • #10
                    When I said anonymously, I meant only the rating on the extra criteria such as Shipping Cost, Shipping Time etc. The comment rating and the positive/neutral/negative would not be anonymous.

                    Originally posted by brands online View Post
                    Oh, another little thing. Why do threads from BOB always start " How should this work, or how should that work?" Why not ever, "What do you guys who use bOB everyday think about this or that?"- Just a thought
                    Perhaps a misleading thread-title, but I did ask as the closing of the original post for comments and how people think about that. I will keep this in mind for the next thread though.

                    Nonetheless - it's good to get feedback this way and great to see the recommendations/concerns coming through...
                    Review on
                    Motivation is what gets you started. Habit is what keeps you going.


                    • #11
                      I typed out a reply and it disappeared.
                      Briefly after a rethink annoyomous ratings would only make one wonder who is unhappy.We cant sort out a problem with someone if we dont know who is unhappy.

                      I dont know why Bidorbuy dont draft an email to buyers and sellers on the rating system and how it should be used even if it is already on Bob.
                      It needs to be reinforced as to how the 3 ratings should be used.

                      Communication between buyers and sellers is so important.

                      If I dont rate a buyer when he pays how would he know where he stands?
                      It is the same with the buyer not rating the seller.It always leaves the transaction incomplete and " in the air"
                      Loosing a rating does not concern me it is just knowing that the buyer has received the item that concerns me.
                      Last edited by geewhizz; 16-07-10, 00:15.
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                      • #12
                        geewhizz, if a buyer didn't receive their item, I can almost guarantee you'll know :D
                        "Where Delivery Meets Expectation"


                        • #13
                          Maybe I should just ignore it then. Not so sure.Some buyers buy a number of items and believe me I have had cases where I have followed up a buyer who has not rated me and the parcel has been at the post office for 2 to 3 weeks.

                          I have even had cases where a parcel is returned after more than a month and no inquiry has been made by the buyer.
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                          • #14
                            I like the idea.. But can you put something on for dropshippers please? Something like "delivered within the stated timeframe if ordered from supplier" or something to that effect. I'm concerned that although a listing may state 3-5 weeks for delivery, a buyer may still rate low for delivery time..
                            I know not what World War 3 will be fought with, but World War 4 will be fought with sticks & stones - Albert Einstein.


                            • #15
                              I personally i don't like the idea of annoyomous as one wants to know who rated what and sort out the problem (if one) with that person first before running to mom & dad (BOB). Personally it should be commom curticy to give ratings as soon as payments made or items recieved and mybe a name and shame system will help GEEWHIZZ in his problem i.e. if you have done say 10 transactions but only rated on say 6 of them you will have a 60% ratings given next to your name. mybe this will compell people to rate. I do like the rating options in the example as it gives a more indepth description of the person you are dealing with although some of the options their aren't nessesary.